Comma conundrums & other punctuation perplexities

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  • Jennie Ann

    LeAnne, much appreciated. I think I may go with Example A. Thanks!
  • Cynthia Dunbar

    Exactly what is the deal with the phrase "All's I know"? I can't figure out if it's "All's I know" or "Alls I know." I have found some information about it on Google, but it only confused me. (Sure -- nice to know it's some bastardization of English via German or Scandinavian syntax, but I just want to know if I need an apostrophe or not.)

    http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/001253.html

    Any thoughts are appreciated!
  • Brenda Rogers

    I use an apostrophe. It's some colloquial contraction that can't be broken down directly, similar to ain't. Use all's, global it, and forget it. :)
  • Brenda Rogers

    LOL Debi! I didn't see your post before mine. I've seen and used all's before. "All as" was referenced in the article that Cynthia linked. Let's just hope it doesn't become as acceptable as towards!
  • Cynthia Dunbar

    Well, I won't worry about it too much...but thank you for the thoughts! It's not quite like worrying about how to properly capture "fo' shizzle" in a transcript, but it's close. :)
  • LeAnne Law

    How long altogether was she in the office?
    or
    How long all together was she in the office?
  • Brenda Rogers

    adverb: with everything included or counted ("Altogether he earns close to a million dollars")

    From Common English Errors http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~brians/errors/altogether.html
  • LeAnne Law

    Thanks, Brenda.
  • Jennie Ann

    I cannot figure out how best to hyphenate this, and if it only came up once, I wouldn't worry so much, but this phrase is used several times.

    This is one full sentence with the phrase at the end:

    "At its first issue, the workgroup analzyed the pandemic H1N1 influenza preparedness planning of Federal agencies with special emphasis on occupational-safety-and-health-related aspects."

    Should there be hyphens there?

    Example A. occupational-safety-and-health-related aspects
    Example B. occupational safety and health-related aspects
    Example C. occupational safety and health related aspects (no hyphen)

    What say you?
  • Janet

    I had something similar recently, and I chose Example B.
  • Jennie Ann

    Thanks, Janet. My mind is so cluttered this morning. I need to defrag my brain right now. LOL!
  • Christine Kirley

    Jennie
    I would also go with B.
  • Jennie Ann

    I'm working on a transcript about Department of Homeland Security. They spell the word "cybersecurity" as one word all over their website, to include the names of the various departments and agencies under the Department of Homeland Security.

    However, in this meeting, the working groups have the word "Cyber Security" in their title as two words. Yet, DHS, the sponsor of this meeting, spells it as one word. For example, this is National Cybersecurity Awareness Month, according to DHS.

    They did the same thing with "Cross Sector." They titled some presentations with "Cross Sector" such-and-such group as two words, but I usually hyphenate "cross-sector."

    I am trying to be consistent within the transcript, but I've got "Cybersecurity" and "Cyber Security" and "Cross Sector" and "cross-sector."

    Any suggestions how to handle the inconsistencies? Should I just roll with it and forget how it looks?
  • Jennie Ann

    Bump to the top. HELP! Job due tomorrow morning.
  • Christine Kirley

    Jennie,
    The things we trouble ourselves with, huh? I would just go with cybersecurity, one word. Your reasoning -- should anyone ask or care -- is you got if from their website.
    Cross Sector, I would use their version in this case (You got it from their presentations.)

    Normally, they are not even going to care.
  • Jennie Ann

    Hey, thanks so very much, Christine. I keep going back and forth, doing globals, changing it from this to that and then back to the first way.

    To add insult to injury, now they have a Healthcare and Public Health Service Coordinating Council -- "healthcare" one word -- but the name of the entity serving it is Public Health Care -- two words -- Sector. SHEESH!

    I will be bald by the time this transcript is done. I am literally pulling my hair out.
  • LeAnne Law

    Jennie, just pick one and be consistent so they can find it in the index. As Christine said, no one usually cares but us.
  • Jennie Ann

    Thanks, LeAnne. You know, I think you're right in picking one and using that throughout, except with "cybersecurty' and "cyber security."

    There is the Department of Homeland Security's National Cybersecurity Awareness Month, and there is also a National Cyber Security Center. Each entity is spelled differently. I think I am going to keep everything else "cybersecurity," one word, with the one exception of that entity, "National Cyber Security Center.

    I'm putting that hyphen back in cross-sector. So I'll have to go back and do a global for that.

    I'm also going to do a global for "healthcare" as one word. Even though I prefer it as two words, I can live with the one word on "healthcare."

    Thank you again, Christine and LeAnne. When I'm all alone, wondering how to handle these situations, it is nice to have two members of the forum provide their kind advice. I really do miss working in-house because of situations just like this.
  • Christine Kirley

    Jennie,
    You are more than welcome. It will be nice to get that one done, won't it.
  • Rosalie DeLeonardis

    Jennie, 15 years ago when I was a legal secretary I worked for a healthcare partner, and it was always one word. I haven't seen it used as two words in a long time.
  • Brenda Rogers

    I've always used two words. Outside of a business name, I hadn't even seen it as one until a couple yrs ago. Can't trust business names; I never gave it a thought that it might be an acceptable spelling. MW doesn't list it as one and American Heritage has it only as an alternate spelling.

    I'm with Jennie. I don't like it as one, and until it's wrong, I'm continuing to use two. It's one of those things reporters are divided on and neither side is wrong.

    Unlike Jennie, I never worked "in-house" anywhere, so I never had the bouncing-off opportunites until I finally discovered Internet forums.
  • Marla Sharp

    I think "healthcare" will eventually be one word in all dictionaries. But until it becomes one in Merriam-Webster, I'm doing to do it as two words. Personally, I made a decision to stick with one dictionary for consistency. Makes life a little easier on me and my scopists and proofreaders.

    I just hope "website" and "login" never become the norm. Ick.
  • Brenda Rogers

    I use website. It's in American Heritage, which keeps up with things a little better than MW. If I can find *my* favorite in one of those, I'll use it. I think Web site is hopelessly out of step with the times. But like health care and healthcare, neither is wrong.

    However, "login" is ridiculous!
  • Jennie Ann

    Brenda, you and I have similar likes and dislikes. I am still uncomfortable doing "health care" as one word, unless it is the title, like Alabama Healthcare Services.

    Rosalie, I am seeing "healthcare" as one word more often, but my fingers aren't comfortable with typing it that way quite yet. I did do it for this transcript, though. :-)

    Marla, I'm one of those who uses "website" and not "Web site." I swear I see it both ways, and when I switch -- and I have -- to typing "Web site," then, all of a sudden, I see "website" all the time in print. LOL
  • Marla Sharp

    I've found that "website," "login," and "healthcare" are usually one word nowadays in most documents on online. I just decided to follow Merriam-Webster for consistency and to make my life easier. I still cap Internet too.
  • Jennie Ann

    Marla, I cap "Internet" too. I also cap "Web" when it is by itself. Great minds think alike!

    I am always changing my style, and since I have discovered this forum, I have changed a few things that I do.

    I am an old dog who likes to learn new tricks. :-)

  • Brenda Rogers

    Jennie, we DO think alike! :D I do those too and love learning new tricks.
  • LeAnne Law

    Not sure how to punctuate this:

    One of the employees called the Texas -- was it Texas police department? -- and verified the accident that Carole was telling.
  • Kyung

    That's how I do it.
  • Jennie Ann

    LeAnne, I do it exactly the way you have it. :-)
  • Marla Sharp

    I agree, LeAnne. I'd do it the same way.
  • Clay Frazier

    Scheduling -- how frequently did you have to do that?
    Scheduling: how frequently did you have to do that?
    Scheduling, how frequently did you have to do that?
    Scheduling; how frequently did you have to do that?
  • Tami

    C.
  • Christine Kirley

    Clay
    C.
    ( your mom and I had the same English teacher)
  • Marla Sharp

    I agree. I'd choose C. If "scheduling" came after the main clause, I'd use a comma before it (How frequently did you have to do that, scheduling?).
  • Clay Frazier

    But isn't "scheduling" kind of independent? That would essentially be making it a comma splice.

    You wouldn't put -
    What about scheduling, how frequently did you do that?

    Don't get me wrong. I'm the one asking the question. But it's just that they all seem wrong to me for one reason or another.
  • Tami

    Yes, Christine, so I think ours counts for only one vote. :)

    AND . . .

    "What about scheduling, how frequently did you do that?" looks perfectly fine to me. :)
  • Clay Frazier

    it's a comma splice.
  • tami carlson

    I would use the dash. I think the structure is called a "removed appositive." Appositives should be right next to the word they rename or describe.

    You use commas when they are adjacent (like Marla's example).

    Tami
  • Stacy Tegner

    Can you do "What about scheduling? How frequently did you do that?" ~ Would this be correct? I think I tend to do it like this most of the time. I use the comma just like in Marla's example, but the structure example above comes up all the time and I probably should be doing it the right way :)
  • Keith Rowan II

    I also think the comma would be a comma splice there. I would use dashes. Semicolon would probably be acceptable also, better than comma.
  • tami carlson

    I'd do that one the way Stacy did. I see two questions:

    "What about scheduling? How frequently did you do that?"

    If he started with "Tell me about scheduling," that would be a sentence and a question:

    "Tell me about scheduling. How frequently did you do that?"

    Tami
  • Jennie Ann

    Ditto with Stacy and Tami!
  • Jennie Ann

    I'm not sure where to post this, but it's a burning question, one which I know y'all will help me with.

    Would you type "R&D" or "R and D" when they say those letters meaning research and development?

    By the same token, would you type "Q&A" or "Q and A" when they say those letters meaning question and answer?

    In other words, do you use the ampersand symbol or the word "and" when they speak those letters?
  • Marla Sharp

    Most documents you'll find show it all together - R&D. I think the ampersand is more common than using "and," and I'm not sure the space around the ampersand matters all that much.

    Merriam-Webster has it in their dictionary as R & D.
  • Jennie Ann

    Thanks, Marla. I always wanted to know the answer to this, and, as usual, your reply is helpful.
  • Christine Kirley

    Tami,
    Looks fine to me too. I also think a semicolon works as well.
  • Jena Macato

    Quick question that's bugging me. I'm working on a transcript where they keep referring to 4 generations of men.
    Do I write it out, like August the first, or do I do it like this: August, III; August II, etc...? The latter looks good to me, but I just wanted ask.
  • Brenda Rogers

    Yes, Roman numerals is typically how names are listed. Like they think they're royalty. ;) j/k to all who use it! :D
  • Jennie Ann

    Jena, the way I do it, there should be no comma preceding the Roman numeral when following a name.

    In recent times, some style books are dropping the comma preceding "Jr." and "Sr." when following a name, but some style guides still place a comma before "Jr." and "Sr." when following a name.